I advocate for policies where you pay $0 in income tax, you own your workplace, you get free healthcare, you get far more pay for your work and where your vote actually has power. Is that working class enough for you?
UHC stock is down 45% since December and are now under investigation for defrauding medicare. Anthem also cancelled a policy to cap anesthesia coverage the day after because it got so much heat. The entire health insurance industry is in a PR spiral because of this event. It absolutely did have an effect. He may have single handedly sunk the most unforgiving and parasitic insurer in the country.
We won't find out for a while if the increased pressure will result in real policy. The anger is there, hopefully lawmakers respond to this popular sentiment so that more violence doesn't result.
It is a misspelling of “Pharisaical”: describes someone who is hypocritically pious, often emphasizing strict adherence to religious rituals or rules while neglecting their true meaning or spirit. (From Google’s • Al Overview)
No, I vehemently disagree with single-payer systems and no, care is not better in countries that apply it. What is called “health-care” has been carefully developed by the Rockerfellers, their acolytes, the Tuskegee syphilis study, the Ash Conformity study, and exploiting RICO. No one gets better under health care violence. Doctors are not educated to solve problems but to create profit for the industry. The industry is built on the worst conflicts of interests that make the Roman fire chiefs corruption look like child’s play. Do not allow yourselves to think that shifting the administrative costs to taxpayers is going to improve it. We’re paying exorbitant costs for our own demise and failing to address our lifestyle choices. In Luigi Mangione’s case, no one was going to tell him that yoga & tai chi would provide hugely better outcomes than the violence of drilling large screws into his spine and fusing vertebrae. The industry would not profit from that. He is forever a broken man because he never saw his own power to escape the system and seek alternatives. 2 men died and the system of violence profited. NO SINGLE PAYER!! GET YOURSELVES OUT OF THE SYSTEM!
What do you mean "get out of the system" we literally do not have a choice.
Single payer is a far more efficient and equitable system when you cut out the profit motive in paying for people's care. An insurance system which makes its profit off of a product with inelastic demand where the consequences of that profit is people dying is inherently immoral and parasitic.
Every other developed country has at the least single payer, many have a nationalized system. Healthcare is essential for everyone, it is not a commodity.
Bingo. Use your head. Most do not. They look for external sources to save them. When Capitalism fails they run to Socialism. When Socialism fails they run back to Capitalism. Repeat-Repeat-Repeat. Never stopping to consider the power the individual has to chart their own course. We live in a society that values safety above all things. They are scared to drive a car anymore. The author talks about lower classes doing back breaking work. Really? Where? Nobody wants to do that kind of work anymore. At least not in America where you can live on Socialist government handouts. And, most do. As far as insurance denials go, the hospitals are just as culpable as the insurers. Funny how coding incompetence is never part of the conversation. Ask me how I know? I worked in coding compliance at a major hospital. After I retired I had a procedure and two claims denied. I could tell immediately it was the hospital’s fault and I got them both straightened out and paid. But the average person would’ve chalked it up to the big bad insurance company. And, the hospital plays right into being the good cop. Nope. A dearth of competent coders is why AI is being rolled out on both the hospital and insurance sides. Medical billing is complicated mainly because the CDC wants every scrap of data on everyone. ICD-10 diagnoses coding is CDC. CPT procedural coding is AMA. Yet with all that data flowing into their hands they all ran around like chickens with their heads cutoff in 2020. Couldn’t get a handle on the big scary plandemic. That was bullshit of another flavor.
Big guy, you were literally victim to this system and you're still defending it. Health insurance companies should not exist. Period. I don't know how you work in a hospital and not develop empathy for people.
Almost all developed capitalist countries have socialized medicine. Why? Because it's more efficient and doesn't leave its citizens to the mercy of profit leeches.
Market systems don't work humanely in general but they ESPECIALLY don't work humanely when it comes to healthcare– it has inelastic demand meaning it is a necessity for life, the forces that push down prices don't exist creating extreme price gouging– exactly why our subsidized system both doesn't work very well and is so expensive.
We are all victims of this shit system, you're no different.
I added nuance not defense. But nice try at blanket labeling which is the reason your seemingly well meaning rant will fall flat. Just change a few words in your missive and the overarching message of “murder is ok” can be applied to a dozen unfair circumstances facing society. We’re all in the same movie yet everyone interprets it differently. Randomly killing people whom certain people are convinced have fleeced and murdered innocents would generate a very long list. A long list of opposing people. Unfair systems abound. Shooting people won’t change a thing. I’m convinced hospitals killed far more people than covid. I’m convinced the injections are behind the explosion in cancer and falling birth rates. Nobody’s been held accountable. It’s fucked up. But I’m not gonna advocate spraying them all with lead.
Publicly funded insurance isn’t a free pass for hospitals or the government—real accountability still matters. In fact, most public systems cut down on bureaucracy and denial games compared to our current private/public patchwork, which mostly fuels administrative waste and profit-driven delays.
That said, no system is flawless. As an example, Denmark stayed grounded in science and struck a decent balance between freedom and responsibility during covid. Some other countries outperformed the US. But it’s fair to admit some public systems became heavy-handed or even authoritarian, which is always a risk with centralized control.
Still, your concern about “who gets held accountable” isn’t settled. But let’s not ignore that the very profit motive—pharma, insurers, even providers—fueled by government “free shots money,” is what drove the overuse and relentless push for covid vaccines. So would you support stripping away some or all of those incentives to prevent another disaster like that?
You,Sir, are a privileged, bigoted as*****! I’ve heard of people that don’t believe in modern medicine and they DIE. Tai chi will fix your back ? How very stupid !
It's funny because I dumped United Healthcare about 4 years ago or so. Literally every single procedure that was requested by any of my doctors was not even turned it down it was simply ignored. Then on top of that they changed all of the terms of hospitalization without any notification to their customers. It became far more expensive for someone and if you didn't read the fine print and it was very very fine print, you never would have known.
I almost picked them as my advantage plan for Medicare. I am forever grateful that I consulted an insurance agent. Otherwise I would be dead or disabled by now from surgeries I needed.
Generally speaking, it’s deceptive to attempt to answer a question with a question. That’s what you did. Can’t you just answer a question in a straightforward manner?
But I won’t play your game. The executive was not a serial killer. See how that works?
Oftentimes, how the accused (in this case your hero, Luigi) pleads has more to do with circumstances than with whether they actually committed the crime. Murder is a legal determination. Your statement implies that you believe that Mangione killed Thompson using a firearm. So your empty fucking head has determined that it was somehow justified homicide. Based upon what, exactly?
You have trouble writing an understandable sentence. I doubt that you can back up your argument.
And Pagliaccio still has not answered a simple question. Was there due process?
Ummm,I bet you don’t have United health care, or are wealthy enough to not worry about if and what insurance you have. Call me creepy, but justice in any way deserves a thought .
By this same reasoning, Ilhan Omar started out as a "poor" Sudanese refugee that married her brother. By her sheer determination and Federal grants, she graduated college in N Dakota. She then became a congresswoman who is now worth $83 million in 8 short years! Amazing! Someone did something?
I’ve been highly entertained by the grandiosity of the story that has emerged to disguise what is basically a mob hit between rival factions of the medical industrial complex. This faux antiestablishment drama is a very stretched attempt to disguise this murder for what it really is: a casualty in some sort of turf war followed by mass manipulation and a coverup.
Name 1 thing, out of the millions of things government does, just 1, that the government does better and more efficiently than the private sector? Just 1! I'll wait......(crickets chirping).......
Obviously, wealthy people have more options in life, but apparently, wealth didn't help Thompson. Pitting factions of people against each other, or trying to overlay ideology (pure capitalism, pure communism) onto reality never works. View the system as it exists, identify abuses and inefficiencies, correct them. Repeat.
Excellent article. Insurance systems are not capitalism. They create nothing of value and the profits truly are parasitic.
In order for the US to have healthcare for all, the chronic condition epidemic that is spiraling out of control must end. A way to end it is to start with two separate healthcare systems. The insurance available for all can cover acute conditions such as infections, injuries, birthing, birth defects, cancers and can be employer finananced as well as subsidized by redirecting workers comp insurance and automobile and other accident insurance premiums to this system and eliminating lawsuits for medical care. The other insurance can cover chronic conditions caused by eating unhealthy foods and unhealthy lifestyle. This insurance can be be optional and subsidized by employers and individuals, as well as hefty taxes on the junk food and drinks as well as the companies that create these fake foods. Tax credits can be issued to people who don't use this insurance. Within a few years, the incentive to be healthy will take over, and the fake food industrial complex will be gone
Ideally we could nationalize all healthcare like the UK, it's far more efficient and humane when properly funded of course. An easy short term solution that can happen over night almost is just doing single payer medicare for all.
I think the misconception you're running into is that with insurance, you're not paying less for your healthy habits. You are still paying for other people's higher risk, the business wouldn't work if that wasn't the case. As a healthy (on paper) person you're paying more for your low risk. Along with that, people just don't choose to not drink or smoke because their insurance goes up. It's far easier, efficient and humane to have no private health insurance (besides for voluntary procedures). These are companies that profit off of people who are sick, it's simply immoral.
We can solve a lot of these disease problems with one– better access to healthcare which medicare for all would do but also more importantly more funding for addiction services. A medicare for all helps pay for nutritionists and mental healthcare to reduce many of these problems. People are not unhealthy or healthy based on their decisions like the capitalist insurance industry wants you to think. Theres many larger external factors, the biggest one simply being poverty and thus lack of ability to access quality food.
This is absolutely a capitalist problem. This is the incentive of a capitalist system– to privatize and commodify. Healthcare and basic needs should not be a commodity. For the capitalist, these things are just business ventures disconnected from the humans impacted by it. This is why private insurance and healthcare providers are the NUMBER ONE industry in dollars donated to political campaigns. They know theres efforts to make healthcare public and they want to influence politicians to keep it privatized so we keep paying into their profits.
Imagine instead, a world though where you could go to clinic, get treated, have next to no bill and take far less out of your paycheck every week for healthcare.
Thank you for reading, sorry if this response sounds a little harsh I'm really passionate about this topic.
No one becomes wealthy with out the use of society. The labor,education and ingenuity of their employees. The natural resources that belong to all humanity. The use of resources provided by the government which is funded by the taxpayer. What is expected in return is that the wealthy be responsible citizens. Pay your share ,treat your employees compassionately
and fairly . Use your wealth to make the world better,be grateful . Every member of society is entitled food housing education health care and the opportunity to a better life . Which is possible if there were less greed and selfishness.
Pharasical nonsense. Progressives are so far removed from the working class they don’t even recognize them anymore.
I advocate for policies where you pay $0 in income tax, you own your workplace, you get free healthcare, you get far more pay for your work and where your vote actually has power. Is that working class enough for you?
UHC stock is down 45% since December and are now under investigation for defrauding medicare. Anthem also cancelled a policy to cap anesthesia coverage the day after because it got so much heat. The entire health insurance industry is in a PR spiral because of this event. It absolutely did have an effect. He may have single handedly sunk the most unforgiving and parasitic insurer in the country.
We won't find out for a while if the increased pressure will result in real policy. The anger is there, hopefully lawmakers respond to this popular sentiment so that more violence doesn't result.
You are sooo wrong!
What is “Pharasical”?
It is a misspelling of “Pharisaical”: describes someone who is hypocritically pious, often emphasizing strict adherence to religious rituals or rules while neglecting their true meaning or spirit. (From Google’s • Al Overview)
No, I vehemently disagree with single-payer systems and no, care is not better in countries that apply it. What is called “health-care” has been carefully developed by the Rockerfellers, their acolytes, the Tuskegee syphilis study, the Ash Conformity study, and exploiting RICO. No one gets better under health care violence. Doctors are not educated to solve problems but to create profit for the industry. The industry is built on the worst conflicts of interests that make the Roman fire chiefs corruption look like child’s play. Do not allow yourselves to think that shifting the administrative costs to taxpayers is going to improve it. We’re paying exorbitant costs for our own demise and failing to address our lifestyle choices. In Luigi Mangione’s case, no one was going to tell him that yoga & tai chi would provide hugely better outcomes than the violence of drilling large screws into his spine and fusing vertebrae. The industry would not profit from that. He is forever a broken man because he never saw his own power to escape the system and seek alternatives. 2 men died and the system of violence profited. NO SINGLE PAYER!! GET YOURSELVES OUT OF THE SYSTEM!
What do you mean "get out of the system" we literally do not have a choice.
Single payer is a far more efficient and equitable system when you cut out the profit motive in paying for people's care. An insurance system which makes its profit off of a product with inelastic demand where the consequences of that profit is people dying is inherently immoral and parasitic.
Every other developed country has at the least single payer, many have a nationalized system. Healthcare is essential for everyone, it is not a commodity.
Bingo. Use your head. Most do not. They look for external sources to save them. When Capitalism fails they run to Socialism. When Socialism fails they run back to Capitalism. Repeat-Repeat-Repeat. Never stopping to consider the power the individual has to chart their own course. We live in a society that values safety above all things. They are scared to drive a car anymore. The author talks about lower classes doing back breaking work. Really? Where? Nobody wants to do that kind of work anymore. At least not in America where you can live on Socialist government handouts. And, most do. As far as insurance denials go, the hospitals are just as culpable as the insurers. Funny how coding incompetence is never part of the conversation. Ask me how I know? I worked in coding compliance at a major hospital. After I retired I had a procedure and two claims denied. I could tell immediately it was the hospital’s fault and I got them both straightened out and paid. But the average person would’ve chalked it up to the big bad insurance company. And, the hospital plays right into being the good cop. Nope. A dearth of competent coders is why AI is being rolled out on both the hospital and insurance sides. Medical billing is complicated mainly because the CDC wants every scrap of data on everyone. ICD-10 diagnoses coding is CDC. CPT procedural coding is AMA. Yet with all that data flowing into their hands they all ran around like chickens with their heads cutoff in 2020. Couldn’t get a handle on the big scary plandemic. That was bullshit of another flavor.
Big guy, you were literally victim to this system and you're still defending it. Health insurance companies should not exist. Period. I don't know how you work in a hospital and not develop empathy for people.
Almost all developed capitalist countries have socialized medicine. Why? Because it's more efficient and doesn't leave its citizens to the mercy of profit leeches.
Market systems don't work humanely in general but they ESPECIALLY don't work humanely when it comes to healthcare– it has inelastic demand meaning it is a necessity for life, the forces that push down prices don't exist creating extreme price gouging– exactly why our subsidized system both doesn't work very well and is so expensive.
We are all victims of this shit system, you're no different.
I added nuance not defense. But nice try at blanket labeling which is the reason your seemingly well meaning rant will fall flat. Just change a few words in your missive and the overarching message of “murder is ok” can be applied to a dozen unfair circumstances facing society. We’re all in the same movie yet everyone interprets it differently. Randomly killing people whom certain people are convinced have fleeced and murdered innocents would generate a very long list. A long list of opposing people. Unfair systems abound. Shooting people won’t change a thing. I’m convinced hospitals killed far more people than covid. I’m convinced the injections are behind the explosion in cancer and falling birth rates. Nobody’s been held accountable. It’s fucked up. But I’m not gonna advocate spraying them all with lead.
Publicly funded insurance isn’t a free pass for hospitals or the government—real accountability still matters. In fact, most public systems cut down on bureaucracy and denial games compared to our current private/public patchwork, which mostly fuels administrative waste and profit-driven delays.
That said, no system is flawless. As an example, Denmark stayed grounded in science and struck a decent balance between freedom and responsibility during covid. Some other countries outperformed the US. But it’s fair to admit some public systems became heavy-handed or even authoritarian, which is always a risk with centralized control.
Still, your concern about “who gets held accountable” isn’t settled. But let’s not ignore that the very profit motive—pharma, insurers, even providers—fueled by government “free shots money,” is what drove the overuse and relentless push for covid vaccines. So would you support stripping away some or all of those incentives to prevent another disaster like that?
You want to teach me coding
You,Sir, are a privileged, bigoted as*****! I’ve heard of people that don’t believe in modern medicine and they DIE. Tai chi will fix your back ? How very stupid !
God only knows we need working class heroes
https://davidgottfried.substack.com/p/is-luigi-mangione-morally-superior
Luigi is a coward. He murdered a man
He murdered a man that murdered many
Two wrongs make a right now? SMH
No but you reap what you sow
And United healthcare murdered millions, and got paid for it. Long live justice !
It's funny because I dumped United Healthcare about 4 years ago or so. Literally every single procedure that was requested by any of my doctors was not even turned it down it was simply ignored. Then on top of that they changed all of the terms of hospitalization without any notification to their customers. It became far more expensive for someone and if you didn't read the fine print and it was very very fine print, you never would have known.
I almost picked them as my advantage plan for Medicare. I am forever grateful that I consulted an insurance agent. Otherwise I would be dead or disabled by now from surgeries I needed.
So you guys support murderers? What a bunch of creeps y’all are.
No, I don't support Brian Thompson
But you do support Luigi Mangione. Did he do anything wrong, in your opinion?
Depends, do you think its wrong to kill a serial killer?
Generally speaking, it’s deceptive to attempt to answer a question with a question. That’s what you did. Can’t you just answer a question in a straightforward manner?
But I won’t play your game. The executive was not a serial killer. See how that works?
Then who was the killer of all the denied life saving claims? AI?
Treatments don’t always work. When a treatment is administered, but fails, do you call that murder? If you do, you should get your head examined.
Oftentimes, how the accused (in this case your hero, Luigi) pleads has more to do with circumstances than with whether they actually committed the crime. Murder is a legal determination. Your statement implies that you believe that Mangione killed Thompson using a firearm. So your empty fucking head has determined that it was somehow justified homicide. Based upon what, exactly?
You have trouble writing an understandable sentence. I doubt that you can back up your argument.
And Pagliaccio still has not answered a simple question. Was there due process?
Ummm,I bet you don’t have United health care, or are wealthy enough to not worry about if and what insurance you have. Call me creepy, but justice in any way deserves a thought .
I only have Medicare. Yet don’t think it justified to murder people because the government sucks.
What a cynical cruel dog whistle of an article.
By this same reasoning, Ilhan Omar started out as a "poor" Sudanese refugee that married her brother. By her sheer determination and Federal grants, she graduated college in N Dakota. She then became a congresswoman who is now worth $83 million in 8 short years! Amazing! Someone did something?
I’ve been highly entertained by the grandiosity of the story that has emerged to disguise what is basically a mob hit between rival factions of the medical industrial complex. This faux antiestablishment drama is a very stretched attempt to disguise this murder for what it really is: a casualty in some sort of turf war followed by mass manipulation and a coverup.
Name 1 thing, out of the millions of things government does, just 1, that the government does better and more efficiently than the private sector? Just 1! I'll wait......(crickets chirping).......
Oh thats super easy; the NHS in the UK is one of the most efficient healthcare systems in the world despite being very underfunded:
https://www.bmj.com/content/343/bmj.d5143
Obviously, wealthy people have more options in life, but apparently, wealth didn't help Thompson. Pitting factions of people against each other, or trying to overlay ideology (pure capitalism, pure communism) onto reality never works. View the system as it exists, identify abuses and inefficiencies, correct them. Repeat.
Solidarity with the people who suffer from United Healthcare
Excellent article. Insurance systems are not capitalism. They create nothing of value and the profits truly are parasitic.
In order for the US to have healthcare for all, the chronic condition epidemic that is spiraling out of control must end. A way to end it is to start with two separate healthcare systems. The insurance available for all can cover acute conditions such as infections, injuries, birthing, birth defects, cancers and can be employer finananced as well as subsidized by redirecting workers comp insurance and automobile and other accident insurance premiums to this system and eliminating lawsuits for medical care. The other insurance can cover chronic conditions caused by eating unhealthy foods and unhealthy lifestyle. This insurance can be be optional and subsidized by employers and individuals, as well as hefty taxes on the junk food and drinks as well as the companies that create these fake foods. Tax credits can be issued to people who don't use this insurance. Within a few years, the incentive to be healthy will take over, and the fake food industrial complex will be gone
Ideally we could nationalize all healthcare like the UK, it's far more efficient and humane when properly funded of course. An easy short term solution that can happen over night almost is just doing single payer medicare for all.
I think the misconception you're running into is that with insurance, you're not paying less for your healthy habits. You are still paying for other people's higher risk, the business wouldn't work if that wasn't the case. As a healthy (on paper) person you're paying more for your low risk. Along with that, people just don't choose to not drink or smoke because their insurance goes up. It's far easier, efficient and humane to have no private health insurance (besides for voluntary procedures). These are companies that profit off of people who are sick, it's simply immoral.
We can solve a lot of these disease problems with one– better access to healthcare which medicare for all would do but also more importantly more funding for addiction services. A medicare for all helps pay for nutritionists and mental healthcare to reduce many of these problems. People are not unhealthy or healthy based on their decisions like the capitalist insurance industry wants you to think. Theres many larger external factors, the biggest one simply being poverty and thus lack of ability to access quality food.
This is absolutely a capitalist problem. This is the incentive of a capitalist system– to privatize and commodify. Healthcare and basic needs should not be a commodity. For the capitalist, these things are just business ventures disconnected from the humans impacted by it. This is why private insurance and healthcare providers are the NUMBER ONE industry in dollars donated to political campaigns. They know theres efforts to make healthcare public and they want to influence politicians to keep it privatized so we keep paying into their profits.
Imagine instead, a world though where you could go to clinic, get treated, have next to no bill and take far less out of your paycheck every week for healthcare.
Thank you for reading, sorry if this response sounds a little harsh I'm really passionate about this topic.
Not if bill gates can help it. That man has his grubby little hands in everything
The real struggle is not between classes or conservatives and progressives, but between authoritarians and the people who resist them.
So stupid. This guy wasn’t a working class anything
No one becomes wealthy with out the use of society. The labor,education and ingenuity of their employees. The natural resources that belong to all humanity. The use of resources provided by the government which is funded by the taxpayer. What is expected in return is that the wealthy be responsible citizens. Pay your share ,treat your employees compassionately
and fairly . Use your wealth to make the world better,be grateful . Every member of society is entitled food housing education health care and the opportunity to a better life . Which is possible if there were less greed and selfishness.
i
This guy comes from a very very wealthy family, he’s about as working class as Paris Hilton.